R_P wrote:

There's a big difference between claiming that Iraq had an active nuclear weapons program when the Intelligence people in charge of non-proliferation knew there was absolutely no evidence for it and someone actually using nerve agents.

I suppose you think the rebels have access to Russian made planes and chemical bombs and convinced all the people below to go along with a plan to kill their children for some strategic gambit. Or maybe they just imagined their dead kids 

In other news: peas in a pod. The problem was how can you get both parties to work together due to all the polarization?

Palestinian American Prof. Rashid Khalidi in October: Both Clinton & Trump will lead to a direct US war in Syria.
Both parties thrive on war

— Ben Norton (@BenjaminNorton) 7 April 2017

"Trump's not into war.."

And away we go.  43 60 Tomahawks just launched at Syrian airbases while Trump dines with Xi.

U.S. Weighs “Saturation Strike” Against Syrian Government in Response to Chemical Attack
A.k.a. shock and awe carpet bombing?

It's WMD all over again. Why don't you see it? (Peter Hitchens)

Actually knowing something, remembering history or having experience of the world is becoming a disadvantage. How much easier it would be to join in with the flow of opinion about Syria, to listen happily to, and read contentedly, media reports on the subject.

As it is, I feel something close a physical pain as I do this.

Today’s frenzy over alleged use of poison gas in Syria is the 2017 version of Anthony Blair’s WMD in Iraq. Why can you not see it? Did you think they would do it in exactly the same way again? You are being assailed through your emotions, to act first and think long after, and far too late.

How *can* trained journalists (and experienced diplomats) be so lacking in the desire or ability to question what they are told? How come that they accept without hesitation reports which have not come from their own staff, but instead come from within terrifying war zones where gangs of fanatical murderers are the only law? One or two at least have the decency to refer to the new reports of gas attacks as ‘suspected’ or alleged, but most present them as established fact. ‘All the hallmarks’ means in such cases what? Though millions believe this has been proven, past accusations of gas use by Damascus have never been independently shown to be true.

Well, how can facts *be* independently established about such events? Not easily. Alas, that makes it appalling simple to make propaganda without ever facing serious checks. (...)

WikiLeaks Reveals How the US Aggressively Pursued Regime Change in Syria, Igniting a Bloodbath (2015)
Tillerson says US ‘steps under way’ for removal of Syria’s Assad

 R_P wrote: 
thanks for the clarification

maybe my bumbling attempt to go from profit to prophet was lost in the digital ether

 

 miamizsun wrote: 
Even do unto others as you would have them do unto you  fails when 'you' hates themselves or is self destructive.

free will is a bitch ... 

 Capt. Obvious:

 R_P wrote: 

yes in one sense iagree (however humans like yourself can and do profit peacefully and legitimately)

as people are frightened (not always but usually by manufactured boogeymen) they roll over and give/surrender their own power to politicians spouting rhetoric/propaganda

i think it is a form of coercion

political corruption/power is a necessary precursor to state force used to harvest current and future resources (taxation and debt)

currently political power is antithetical to any form of accountability

if we can't say no or disagree then we're f'd (the violence and fleecing continue)

this, as you correctly point out, greases the wheels of the war machine (a political business model)

the overarching philosophical theme i'd also like to point out is the emotional thought process that leads us to abandon the critical and/or fact based thought process (bacon/scientific methodology)

feelings first, facts second

humans need to know and understand the decision making framework to get the effects that we like

this has to be in the context of human/property rights

politicians are people too, and they simply don't have a higher claim on another peaceful individual's life, liberty or justly produced or acquired property

rules should be as universal as possible regardless of fancy hats, costumes and titles

i think we should make as much as possible contractual (well defined so we can hold them accountable)

peace

 miamizsun wrote: 
When it isn't profitable.

when will this f'n insanity stop?

it is never ok to murder, maim innocent peaceful people

women and children?

this can't be allowed to continue

put the guns down and engage in dialog/peaceful negotiation

this type of crime is the worst human rights violation(s) possible

how hard is it to stop or just cease the initiation of violence?

have a look and please say something to your rep

this could work in in several threads here

Escape from Syria - Faiza's story from Bullion on Vimeo.

 Red_Dragon wrote: 
Something something, over there, something something over here.

meanwhile...

Syrian opposition calls for suspension of U.S.-led air strikes

Putin’s Palmyra concert shows he is winning the propaganda war

Salafi armed groups increase attacks in Syria

Speaking in London the same day, US President Barack Obama said that the cessation of hostilities is “fraying,” adding that although he has “always been skeptical about Mr. (Russian President Vladimir) Putin’s actions and motives inside of Syria … we are going to play this option out. If, in fact, the cessation falls apart, we’ll try to put it back together again even as we continue to go after ISIL (Islamic State).” The day before, in remarks in Riyadh with Saudi King Salman bin Abdul-Aziz Al Saud, Obama said, “The cessation of hostilities is obviously under tremendous strain, including continued violations by the (Bashar al-) Assad regime. This violence is yet another reminder that there’s only one way to end this civil war, as our GCC (Gulf Cooperation Council) partners agree — a transitional governing body, a new constitution with free elections, including a transition away from Assad.”

+500 boots. Endorsed by 4 out of 5 autocrats...

One of the frustrations of following the Syria conflict from the Arabic press is that when you then turn to the English language accounts, they tend to play down the importance of al-Qaeda or the Support Front (al-Jabha al-Nusra).

In American parlance, there have just been three sides– the regime of Bashar al-Assad, the Free Syrian Army, and Daesh (ISIS, ISIL). The Free Syrian Army is depicted as democrats deserving US support (only some of them are).

There is a fourth force, however, al-Qaeda, which has been among the more successful fighting groups and which holds key real estate. They led a coalition of hard line Sunni Salafi groups into Idlib city last year. They have a position around Aleppo and inside it.

Even the 33 “vetted” guerrilla groups that are supported by the US CIA via Saudi intelligence often make ad hoc, battlefied alliances with al-Qaeda, and US munitions from other groups flow to the latter.

Al-Qaeda in Syria reports to al-Qaeda leader Ayman al-Zawahiri, a mastermind of the 9/11 attacks, so it is quite disturbing to see American allies coordinating with it. (...)

CIA-armed militias are shooting at Pentagon-armed ones in Syria

Syrian militias armed by different parts of the U.S. war machine have begun to fight each other on the plains between the besieged city of Aleppo and the Turkish border, highlighting how little control U.S. intelligence officers and military planners have over the groups they have financed and trained in the bitter 5-year-old civil war.

The fighting has intensified over the past two months, as CIA-armed units and Pentagon-armed ones have repeatedly shot at each other as they have maneuvered through contested territory on the northern outskirts of Aleppo, U.S. officials and rebel leaders have confirmed.

In mid-February, a CIA-armed militia called Fursan al Haq, or Knights of Righteousness, was run out of the town of Marea, about 20 miles north of Aleppo, by Pentagon-backed Syrian Democratic Forces moving in from Kurdish-controlled areas to the east. (...)

 sirdroseph wrote: 
Not really.  They have been there for some time now.

This however does show 'mission creep'.  Seen this movie before in Nam ...

Syria: Obama authorizes boots on ground to fight ISIS

Earnest said that this key element of U.S. strategy in confronting ISIS hasn't changed with Friday's announcement.
He was also careful to insist: "These forces do not have a combat mission."

...
These troops are not expected to go on raids or into combat, according to the current plan. However, they have the right of self-defense and could seek permission if needed to go into the field.

There will be additional Special Operations forces available for raids against targets in both Syria and Iraq when high-value ISIS targets are identified, the official said.