Lazy8 wrote: 
*checks watch*

As amusing as it might be to watch Hippiechick try and justify her hatred for Republicans, in fairness I have to say that there is another, deeper problem evidenced here. And it's not just her.

We have a problem in the US with one-dimensional political thinking. There is the good guys and the Other Guys. Our media tends to reinforce this, looking at all issues as if there were only two sides and mapping every type of thought onto a left-right axis. The left end is good and wholesome and peace and love, the right end is seething with ethnic and religious intolerance, ignorant savages one AM radio sermon away from lynchings and witch burnings.

I'm on the receiving end of that snide condescension maybe once a day here, and I'm not even a Republican. But I'm not in the left corner of the political universe, and the only label available is "Republican" so I'm automatically a fundamentalist christian, a conservative, and stupid because those are the scary things in the bottom of the box I've been tossed in.

I'd like out, please. But even more I'd like everybody to abandon the idea that there are good and bad guys. Get out more, meet some people who aren't like you. The world will look like a different place!

But it won't be. It'll be the same place it was all along. You'll just see more of it for what it is instead of what you're afraid it is.

 arsenault wrote: 
Well, that's stereotyping but, it is a necessary precursor to prejudice and bigotry.

And, Randy, yup.

This all started with a video of a man, claiming to represent as the Voice of God (ordained minister) praying that the President would die and go to hell.  This is fact - no opinion necessary.  Beaker immediately started defending and diverting the topic, which is common for him, and this is what ensues - this is what always ensues when he gets involved - he does this on purpose, and people get sucked in and he is entertained by it - it's been like this since he's been here, no matter what name he's used.

I make it a point to stop by and remind him that, once again, he's acting like some throwback from the Brown Shirt era, and that I'm disgusted by it, and that's that.

It's not that big of a deal, really.

 hippiechick wrote: 
you stated it. I asked if you meant all republicans and you said yes. all republicans. repugs you call them. You've typed repugs so many times, finding that quote is a needle in a haystack. but I remember it distinctly. It left me speechless.

I'm not excusing anyone. my beef is with intolerance and hate on both sides. you don't seem to recognize when it's coming from the left or yourself. seriously. step out of yourself and look at what you're saying. It's hardly peace and love.
Comparing Hitler to anyone looks wrong to me. it was wrong when it was done to Bush as well.

 hippiechick wrote: 
So we have one group that's "largely white" (how largely?), and another that's "largely" female including "many" white evangelical Christians. From this and watching the Republican convention, you extrapolate a Republican party that's mostly white Christians with fundamentalist leanings? I don't see how that's justified.

Of course, there's also that "Clearly, there is more than one kind of conservative." 

 winter wrote: 
The demographics might have changed some, but it still gives a fair portrayal of who is drawn to each party. It's just that the Republican Party might be less optimistic now that they are no longer the party in charge.

The three GOP groups are highly diverse, and this is reflected in their values. The staunchly conservative Enterprisers have perhaps the most consistent ideological profile of any group in the typology. They are highly patriotic and strongly pro-business, oppose social welfare and overwhelmingly support an assertive foreign policy. This group is largely white, well-educated, affluent and male ­ more than three-quarters are men.

Social Conservatives agree with Enterprisers on most issues, but they tend to be critical of business and supportive of government regulation to protect the public good and the environment. They also express deep concerns about the growing number of immigrants in America. This largely female group includes many white evangelical Christians, and nearly half of Social Conservatives live in the South.

This group also is highly concentrated in the South, and, of the three core Republican groups, had the lowest turnout in the 2004 election.

Clearly, there is more than one kind of conservative. The Republican groups find common ground on cultural values, but opinions on the role of government, a defining feature of conservative philosophy for decades, are now among the most divisive for the GOP.

 hippiechick wrote: 
The article is over four years old. In politics, that's fairly old news.

I would also point out the passage that starts with, "The three GOP groups are highly diverse, and this is reflected in their values." Not exactly the monolith you've been painting.

 arsenault wrote: 
show me where I said "all"

 hippiechick wrote: 
really? read your words...

prejudice, bigotry:....'all republicans are...'
                               'all black people are....'

 winter wrote: 
Here is an article from Pew Research that talks about the differences between Democrat and Republican:

http://people-press.org/report/242/beyond-red-vs-blue

All this spewing says much more about the spewer than the spewee.

 arsenault wrote: 
How was it bigotry?

 hippiechick wrote: 
If your evidence for asserting that most Republicans are white Christians is what you saw at the Republican convention, you're missing a few things. For one, I'm not sure how you can identify someone as Christian by seeing them on TV. 

For another, the conventions for both parties are full of the party's most faithful. They're not necessarily representative of the membership as a whole. Look at Congress, after all: the demographics of the House and the Senate are nowhere near the actual demographics of the country they represent.

You're making a sweeping generalization from very little information. It's much like characterizing the Democratic party as the party of lazy people who want everything for nothing, hate the rich, and don't understand the real world. I'm sure there are Democrats who fit that description, but not all of them do.

And every time you make these sweeping generalizations, you keep yourself from seeing others as they are. You miss the chance to understand them and their positions. And you shut off the dialog that needs to happen so we can all move forward. 

 hippiechick wrote: 
what you wrote was bigotry....
go back and read it. it was a little shocking.

 winter wrote: 
So, you deny that Republicans are mostly white and Christian? Did you watch the convention? Skateboarders and vegetarians do not tend to be Republicans, although I do know one.

I think that people read into what I write with their own views, and misunderstand what I am saying. I don't make this stuff up, I read polls, I watch the news, not just msnbc, and sometimes even Fox, for as long as I can stand it, and I do not follow anyone's ideology.

 cc_rider wrote: 

 hippiechick wrote: 
I don't think that's true at all. I think you're reducing everyone not like you ('the Right has one basic ideology, whereas the people on the Left are basically, everyone else") to a caricature.

And I think it's disappointing that the community here keeps having to point out how wrong and offensive it is for you to keep demonizing, belittling, and denigrating those you disagree with. Considering that you supported Obama in part because he doesn't do those things, it's more than a little puzzling that you keep doing them.

I'd call myself a moderate liberal. I don't agree with those on the right very often. Sometimes I do, because my own upbringing and sensibilities are fairly conservative. Sometimes I think they have good points but are missing the bigger picture. Sometimes I think they're miles off base. But I don't think they're all the same any more than I think all left-wingers or all skateboarders or all vegetarians are the same. No one is so small and simple they can be wholly defined by a single characteristic. 

 JrzyTmata wrote: 
I have never said that I hate all republicans. I would like to see if I have. But, in most cases, their ideology makes me very uncomfortable. My cousin used to email me all this crazy, right wing, pro Israel stuff, and I had to stop communicating with her, because I just have a hard time understanding how a person could be so hateful, and why would I want to associate with someone like that. That's a lot different from hatred.

But how can you excuse the politicians of the Republican Party, like Bachmann and Grassley, for saying the things they have said? Is it acceptable to you that they make up lies to defeat the healthcare plan? Does the news of the torture committed in your name bother you at all? Does comparing Obama to Hitler look wrong to you?

Everybody likes to believe that they are right (not as in right wing) and nobody wants to be wrong. It's human nature. Even if you admit that you are wrong, then you immediately become right again.

People have different realities, depending on all the different aspects of their lives. The point I was trying to make is that the people on the Right are much less diverse than the people on the Left, because the Right has one basic ideology, where the people on the Left are basically, everyone else. People of color, different religions, etc., whereas the majority of those on the Right are white, Christian, leaning toward fundamentalism, and have the exact same ideology, which is passed to them by the more vocal of those of similar beliefs. So, to those of us on the Left, those on the Right look angry and fearful, and easily manipulated by idiots like Limbaugh and Beck.

And the Right, from what I know from living with one for most of my young life, are sure that the Left is going to give away the farm, take your money and give it to the undeserving poor, and take away their gun.

My father was a RightWingNut, a Nixon Republican who listened to some crazy guy on the radio and sounded every bit like these people at demonstrations. He used to argue hie beliefs with every breath, and even at age 11 I could recognize that his ideas were wrong headed. He wasn't a bad man, he was a 10 gallon blood donor, he volunteered at the VA every Christmas so the Christian peole could be home with his family. But ideas have been proven to be completely off base.

 hippiechick wrote: 
As a Left-leaning type, I have to take exception to your characterization of my brethren. Peace love and inclusion are not automatically part of the Left's platform, unfortunately. Leftist organizations such as Unions were notorious for violence, intimidation and exclusion. We might also remind everyone that the current Communist regimes are not exactly singing Kumbaya either. To be fair, Communism is, in my opinion, just Fascism with a better PR campaign. Not my original idea or words, but I'm not sure who to attribute them to.

There are PLENTY of Left Wing Nuts. PLENTY. Plenty of people who think they should have all the luxuries and niceties they see other people with, but without the hard work and sacrifices those people made to have those things. I see it all the time, and it really pisses me off. Worse yet, our wonderful capitalists have figured out these people can be easy prey. Witness the proliferation of 'payday loan' outfits: you want your bling? no problem! put your car up for collateral, and we'll only charge 30% interest on your loan. Anybody seen those 'rent-a-tire' places? Incredible. You can actually RENT 20" chrome wheels and tires. All the bling, for just $100 a month. Idiotic. Instead of, oh I don't know, SAVING some money like responsible Right Wing types might, just SPEND it all, every penny of your paycheck, every month.

It's true, I have a good job and I make good money. I have a nice house and cars that run well. But you know what? My newest car is eleven years old. I have not had a car payment for eight years, and don't intend to ever have one again. I have no qualms about buying clothes at Goodwill: I'm wearing a great pair of hiking shoes I bought for ten bucks. My (one) TV is a 27" CRT, my stereo is at least fifteen years old. I don't have an iPhone, or a laptop, or a cell phone with a camera. People see my house and say 'man, you sure are lucky. I wish I had a house like that'. Luck? How about, oh I don't know, WORK?

But no matter. There are plenty of irresponsible Right Wingers too. The point is, the political spectrum is home to all manner of personalities. There are jerks and a$$holes in every single political party, ever. Characterizing one as the party of peace love and inclusion is disingenuous at best.