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kurtster

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Location: where fear is not a virtue
Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 21, 2023 - 5:54pm

 Isabeau wrote:

Imho, this quote from Nikola Tesla, says it best:

If you want to Understand the Secrets of the Universe; think in terms of Energy, Frequency and Vibration. 
 
You never cease to amaze me.  {#Notworthy}
Isabeau

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Location: sou' tex
Gender: Female


Posted: Apr 21, 2023 - 5:16pm

As a recovering Catholic, rejecting Deities is simple. Not so easy is to dismiss certain practices of focusing the mind, intention, meditation that often brings peace and healing to people. If one excepts the 'belief' in atoms (Have YOU personally looked through an Electron Microscope?) most of us just take it for granted that they exist without ever having seen them. Humans throughout history have witnessed how the focus of a disciplined mind can manifest extraordinary things.
Imho, this quote from Nikola Tesla, says it best:

If you want to Understand the Secrets of the Universe; think in terms of Energy, Frequency and Vibration. 

Isabeau

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Location: sou' tex
Gender: Female


Posted: Apr 21, 2023 - 4:52pm

 R_P wrote:

MAW-UM! I KNOW I CAN LOOK it up!!  Just wanted peep's interpretations and perceptions... 


R_P

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Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 21, 2023 - 4:49pm

 Isabeau wrote:

An Atheist primarily rejects the existence of a singular Deity and/or belief system, correct? 
Agnostic is the refusal to acknowledge anything beyond this reality,  right?


Theism - Wikipedia
Isabeau

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Location: sou' tex
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Posted: Apr 21, 2023 - 4:27pm

 lily34 wrote:

funny that Gideon just played on the RP mix i'm listening to.


Neeney neeney, Neeney neeney ...

Isabeau

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Location: sou' tex
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Posted: Apr 21, 2023 - 4:26pm

An Atheist primarily rejects the existence of a singular Deity and/or belief system, correct? 
Agnostic is the refusal to acknowledge anything beyond this reality,  right?
NoEnzLefttoSplit

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Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 21, 2023 - 12:20pm

 black321 wrote:

Faith would appear to have nothing to do with intelligence.

"The assent of the mind to the truth of a proposition or statement for which there is not complete evidence; belief in general."



If we forget the religious side of  faith for a bit, we can see that there are plenty of scientists who firmly believe in whatever scientific orthodox takes their fancy and will hold true to it even in the face of evidence to the contrary. Admittedly, these people are bad scientists, but the point is that religious believers are not the only ones out there who have faith in something or other.
On the other hand, there are scientists who are religious, but are pretty clear in their own minds about where the border lies between the two and are quite open to questioning their scientific beliefs and are for that reason, very good scientists.

The most important thing to remember is that we will, by definition, never have complete evidence because our minds are made to make a model the world, so we will always be one step behind, so to speak. To think otherwise would be for me a sign of bad faith or simply human hubris.

Which is where I start to take exception with the more militant atheists who are happy to vilify others for their beliefs but turn a blind eye to the elephant in the room, namely that all of our mental models of the world necessitate a leap of faith. 

For me the truly intelligent acknowledge that fact and will walk forward humbly into the dark night, always ready to revise their mental models.
Orthodoxy, on the other hand, be it religious, cultural or scientific is a sign of intellectual laziness. 

Full disclosure.. despite all appearances to the contrary, I actually am an atheist.

R_P

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Posted: Apr 21, 2023 - 12:18pm

Everyone who is arrogant in heart is an abomination to the Lord; be assured, he will not go unpunished
black321

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Location: An earth without maps
Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 21, 2023 - 11:38am

Faith would appear to have nothing to do with intelligence.

"The assent of the mind to the truth of a proposition or statement for which there is not complete evidence; belief in general."

Proclivities

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Location: Paris of the Piedmont
Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 21, 2023 - 8:41am

 rgio wrote:

Or could it be that intelligence is perceived as arrogance?   Could it be that "God-fearing", religious folk just aren't as smart, experiencing reason and logic as arrogance based primarily on thier own intellectual limitations?

The Relationship between Intelligence and Religion

Summary

It is shown that intelligence measured in psychometric g (general intelligence) is negatively related to religious belief. We also examine
whether this negative relationship between intelligence and religious
belief is present among nations.



It's possible of course, but meta-analyses can be employed for any desired conclusion or to confirm one's biases or beliefs.  There are countless variables and interactions.  Anyhow, being dismissive is not the same as being intelligent.
kurtster

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Location: where fear is not a virtue
Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 21, 2023 - 8:41am

 rgio wrote:
The Relationship between Intelligence and Religion

Summary

It is shown that intelligence measured in psychometric g (general intelligence) is negatively related to religious belief. We also examine
whether this negative relationship between intelligence and religious
belief is present among nations.
 
Well on at least one occasion, prior to a surgery, the surgeon asked if I would join him in prayer before the surgery.  I did.
lily34

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Location: GTFO
Gender: Female


Posted: Apr 21, 2023 - 8:10am

funny that Gideon just played on the RP mix i'm listening to.
rgio

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Location: West Jersey
Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 21, 2023 - 8:03am

 Proclivities wrote:
Some people are just arrogant and argumentative about their beliefs or opinions; it doesn't really have anything to do with their views on things like religion or theism. 

Or could it be that intelligence is perceived as arrogance?   Could it be that "God-fearing", religious folk just aren't as smart, experiencing reason and logic as arrogance based primarily on thier own intellectual limitations?

The Relationship between Intelligence and Religion

Summary

It is shown that intelligence measured in psychometric g (general intelligence) is negatively related to religious belief. We also examine
whether this negative relationship between intelligence and religious
belief is present among nations.


black321

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Location: An earth without maps
Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 21, 2023 - 7:57am

 Proclivities wrote:

Some people are just arrogant and argumentative about their beliefs or opinions; it doesn't really have anything to do with their views on things like religion or theism.  Sure, I've met militant, evangelical atheists who want to convert others to their beliefs and are dismissive of those who disagree with them, but I've met religious people with the same behaviors.  I've met vegans or vegetarians, or bicyclists with similar traits.  Arrogance is a human behavior - perhaps a flaw - but it's not exclusive to one group of people, it's just that it's the arrogant or "loudest" ones who are more easily noticed and seem to represent whichever group they are from.
  Some people just like to argue.


Gotta serve somebody
Proclivities

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Location: Paris of the Piedmont
Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 21, 2023 - 7:52am

 Lazy8 wrote:

No they don't!



Lazy8

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Location: The Gallatin Valley of Montana
Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 21, 2023 - 7:49am

 Proclivities wrote:
Some people just like to argue.

No they don't!
Proclivities

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Location: Paris of the Piedmont
Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 21, 2023 - 6:37am

 thisbody wrote:

Besides any question of a creator or not, why do atheists always appear to be so arrogant, when counter-arguing any theism at all? 

Beats me. 

Just recently dug into this one bestseller by a jewish author on the history of mankind (novel, hyped)... 

Again, same issue. 

Boring in the long run, even though partially funny.


Some people are just arrogant and argumentative about their beliefs or opinions; it doesn't really have anything to do with their views on things like religion or theism.  Sure, I've met militant, evangelical atheists who want to convert others to their beliefs and are dismissive of those who disagree with them, but I've met religious people with the same behaviors.  I've met vegans or vegetarians, or bicyclists with similar traits.  Arrogance is a human behavior - perhaps a flaw - but it's not exclusive to one group of people, it's just that it's the arrogant or "loudest" ones who are more easily noticed and seem to represent whichever group they are from.
  Some people just like to argue.
maryte

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Location: Blinding You With Library Science!
Gender: Female


Posted: Apr 21, 2023 - 6:08am

 Lazy8 wrote:

It's National Ask an Atheist Day, and I see we already have a question!

We appear arrogant because it's hard—very hard—to face the same stupid argument over and over and continue to take it seriously. We're human.

And it's boring for us too, but the situations are a mite different—there's a massive power imbalance between the camps. No atheist will tell you you aren't qualified to run for office, sit on a jury, or raise children because you have an invisible friend. We wouldn't kick you out of the Boy Scouts, or tell our children not to play with yours. We don't stone people to death over who they want to have sex with.

If you'd rather not face stinging sarcasm come up with a question that hasn't been asked and answered over and over.

You're welcome!



Lazy8

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Location: The Gallatin Valley of Montana
Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 20, 2023 - 8:49pm


oldviolin

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Location: esse quam videri
Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 20, 2023 - 11:38am

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