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NoEnzLefttoSplit

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Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 25, 2023 - 12:59pm

 westslope wrote:

The alternative would have been to slowly, patiently co-opt Russia into the western family.  That would have been great for US economic outcomes given the resource richness of Russia and great for US security interests given Russia's international relations and peculiar talents in the realm of security.    That would have secured eastern European security in a cost-effective, sustainable manner.  



Far out, you project a lot.  It's almost like you are.. um... nah, whatever. 

Let's take the one point where we could perhaps find some agreement, namely in the above paragraph.  
Given that this appears to be your preferred option post 1989, perhaps you could please enlighten me as to why things took the course they did, because this "patiently co-opting" Russia into the western family sums up German policy in a nutshell.  

So, why didn't it work? Russia was creaming it and had half of Europe dependent on its oil and gas supplies. Economy was rock solid, trade balance likewise..  so why throw it all away? Or at least risk destroying such a cozy arrangement?


westslope

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Location: BC sage brush steppe


Posted: Mar 25, 2023 - 12:45pm

 NoEnzLefttoSplit wrote:

now, about Ukraine.


First, Happy Monroe Doctrine,  NoEnzo.  Which is a fancy of saying, Happy Hypocritical Killing of Innocents! 

Let's roll the clock back to WW II.  Recall that many regard WW II to be a direct result of the harsh punishing conditions of the Treaty of Versailles.

3 1/2 million Germanic and Slavic peoples of Jewish descent died in horrific conditions.  Would you have preferred to see more die?

18 million or more Russians died.   Not enough for you?    Many credit Russian resistance and sacrifices as the key element in the bid to crush the Nazi existential threat.

Recall that the USA sealed victory against the Nazis by directly targeting innocent civilians in German industrial towns.  Not with percussion bombs but with fire bombs.  Lovely, eh? 

The USA and fellow travelling companions were warned not to push NATO into former Warsaw Pact countries.  Did it anyways.  For what?  The promise of greater US agricultural and weapon system exports?   The USA initially promised not to do that but as is so often the case broke its word.  Forked tongue all over again.

The alternative would have been to slowly, patiently co-opt Russia into the western family.  That would have been great for US economic outcomes given the resource richness of Russia and great for US security interests given Russia's international relations and peculiar talents in the realm of security.    That would have secured eastern European security in a cost-effective, sustainable manner.  

Yet you support the invasion of the Holy Lands by Germanic and Slavic peoples calling themselves Jewish, the ethnic cleansing origins of the Jewish-only Israeli state and now the settlement of the West Bank by Jewish-only settlers, militarily occupied since 1967.  It is interesting when the Israeli state deploys tactics widely used by those fighting Nazism to demonize Nazis,  you and others say nothing.     

Admit it, you are a fan of the Hill Top Youths (brown shirts?) and the Outposts, are you not?   You approved of the Gestapo-like sweep of the West Bank conducted by the IOF in 2016 against Hamas at the very moment that Hamas appeared ready to sign on to the accords between the PA and Israel.  You have no issue with Israeli kill ratios do you?  Does 1:5 meet your approval? 

Here we are.   How many hundred of thousands of more Ukrainian lives are you willing to sacrifice in order to attain glorious victory in Ukraine?  How far are you willing to punish European economies or drive the US debt higher?    How much are you willing to weaken and erode US hegemony in order to accomplish this goal?

Or put differently, explain to us how this bloody proxy war fueled by NATO weapons will ultimately make the USA stronger.






NoEnzLefttoSplit

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Posted: Mar 25, 2023 - 12:16pm

 westslope wrote:

Jean Chrétien... suggested that you could not simply invade every country whose leader you did not like. 


now, about Ukraine.

westslope

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Location: BC sage brush steppe


Posted: Mar 25, 2023 - 12:11pm

Jean Chrétien is easily the best Canadian prime minister in the postwar period.  Here he shares bits of his discussions with President George Bush and Prime Minister Tony Blair when he said no to join the  'coalition of the willing' in the invasion and occupation of Iraq.  

He also explains why that decision unnerved so many Canadians, especially the business elite who feared revenge from the USA.  Chrétien simply asked for a list of things that Canada was selling to the USA, that it did not need.  The list never materialized. 

Bush and Chrétien went on to discuss sports and other more pleasant things.  Blair had another motive for invading and occupying Iraq.  Saddam Hussein was an awful dictator.  Chrétien asked Blair why he did not want to invade and occupy Zimbabwe in order to overthrow Robert Mugabe and suggested that you could not simply invade every country whose leader you did not like. Blair did not speak with him for a year.  History has not been kind to either leader, especially Tony Blair.

At the age of 89, Chrétien is sharper than both Trump and Biden combined.  
R_P

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Posted: Mar 24, 2023 - 7:01pm

Uh-oh

NoEnzLefttoSplit

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Posted: Mar 23, 2023 - 12:29pm

 oldviolin wrote:


Like the last line about failing.  I think I'm getting better and better at it, the older I get. 
westslope

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Location: BC sage brush steppe


Posted: Mar 23, 2023 - 12:29pm

These poll results are absolutely fascinating, especially the attitudes of quebecois to 'Canada'.


Views from (both sides of) the 49th: Canadians take more pride in their country than Americans do in their own

Nine-in-ten in Canada (89%) say their country is a safe place to live; half as many say this in U.S. (43%)

Wow,  Just wow.  Did not see that one coming.  83% of quebecois see Canada as a country they are proud to live in.   

If at all accurate, this is proof of the success of the efforts of the Canadian state and civil society to slowly, patiently co-opt quebecois nationalism over the decades.  
westslope

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Location: BC sage brush steppe


Posted: Mar 23, 2023 - 12:19pm

 Beaker wrote:

Welp.  I have long said that US politics are far more interesting than the milquetoast we see in Canada. 

No longer.

We've now got our intelligence community whistleblowing on corrupt politicians at all levels of government.  Up to 12 politicians or candidates are affected, from multiple parties. Our PM makes excuses one day and calls those accusing a politician racist.  The very next day, more damaging information is leaked and the CCP compromised MP resigns from the governing Lib party.

There will be lots more to come.  2 down, more to come.  

This government needs to fall, and right now.


This really sad.  It is now official.  Canadians are just as easy to mislead and manipulate as Americans.  

Yes, this government should fall but who will replace it?  Pierre Pollievre's Conservative Party that promotes monetary policy that will have Canadians wearing grass skirts and living in thatched roof huts?  


Beaker

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Location: Your safe space


Posted: Mar 23, 2023 - 8:19am

Welp.  I have long said that US politics are far more interesting than the milquetoast we see in Canada. 

No longer.

We've now got our intelligence community whistleblowing on corrupt politicians at all levels of government.  Up to 12 politicians or candidates are affected, from multiple parties. Our PM makes excuses one day and calls those accusing a politician racist.  The very next day, more damaging information is leaked and the CCP compromised MP resigns from the governing Lib party.

There will be lots more to come.  2 down, more to come.  

This government needs to fall, and right now.

oldviolin

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Posted: Mar 19, 2023 - 7:36pm

 ScottFromWyoming wrote:
 oldviolin wrote:
Seems pretty straightforward; I'm sure a lot of people have had the same idea and failed over and over. 
 
He had a notion and he went with it. His P&M believed in him. What could go wrong?
ScottFromWyoming

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Posted: Mar 19, 2023 - 1:53pm

 oldviolin wrote:


Seems pretty straightforward; I'm sure a lot of people have had the same idea and failed over and over. 
oldviolin

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Posted: Mar 19, 2023 - 1:15pm

haresfur

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Posted: Mar 13, 2023 - 7:04pm

 R_P wrote:



I'm good with that
R_P

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Posted: Mar 13, 2023 - 12:36pm


westslope

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Location: BC sage brush steppe


Posted: Feb 2, 2023 - 3:19pm



Benedict Cumberbatch reads a hilarious letter of apology to a hotel



In March of 2018, 18 years after being banned from the Empress Hotel in British Columbia, Novia Scotia resident Nick Burchill wrote them a letter and asked for forgiveness. Three days later, by which point his letter had been reprinted online and read by millions, the ban was lifted.

Benedict Cumberbatch performed this letter at Letters Live at the Royal Albert Hall, London in October 2022.

Steely_D

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Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 27, 2022 - 6:33pm

 haresfur wrote:

You might consider the possibility that you don't know what the heck you are talking about



Like that's gonna happen. All we can expect are more frothy fringe YouTube posts that no one watches.
haresfur

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Posted: Nov 27, 2022 - 4:39pm

 sirdroseph wrote:
Of all the authoritarian despots, Arden, Daniel Andrews, Biden, Zelensky, Macron, the EU itself and all of the other Klaus Schwab installations, this one is the biggest piece of excrement.  I don't see how Canadians let it go this far:
 
 

You might consider the possibility that you don't know what the heck you are talking about

sirdroseph

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Posted: Nov 26, 2022 - 4:02am

Of all the authoritarian despots, Arden, Daniel Andrews, Biden, Zelensky, Macron, the EU itself and all of the other Klaus Schwab installations, this one is the biggest piece of excrement.  I don't see how Canadians let it go this far:
 
 
sirdroseph

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Gender: Male


Posted: Oct 28, 2022 - 4:18am

westslope

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Location: BC sage brush steppe


Posted: Oct 27, 2022 - 2:55pm

 sirdroseph wrote:


sirdroseph: You were remiss.  You should always include an explicit warning should Tucker Carlson be the TV host of the video.   As a person of Christian heritage, I forgive you.

My quebecoise mother-in-law went this route two years ago.  She had terminal cancer and all her bodily functions including her otherwise sharp mind  were giving out on her.   Former tobacco and alcohol addict.  She wanted it; we agreed and helped her.  BC provincial government medical staff were superb.   No charge.

It is the Quebec College of Physicians that have recommended that euthanasia be extended to severely disabled children.   I am personally open to the idea;   I am not willing to condemn the societies and cultures that have practiced infanticide throughout history.  We are a social being.

But frankly, this is much to do about nothing because the notion of legally sanctioned infanticide will not fly with the Canadian electorate.    Not for many decades.  

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