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Post to this Topic
black321

black321 Avatar

Location: An earth without maps
Gender: Male


Posted: Dec 9, 2025 - 8:58am

 miamizsun wrote:


proper labelling is essential in building a solution
i get that we all want affordable and free goods (and services)
but there is a cost for these services
in healthcare, i think the biggest expenses are hospitals, doctors and to a lesser degree staff, then admin and insurance overhead
pushing six trillion or so (fifteen to sixteen thousand busk per person)
that has to come down drastically before we just start throwing more money into that beast
asking or forcing a small group of people to take care of this will not work 
obviously cannibalizing successful people or producers would also cause your tax rev to fall through the floor (they would stop being productive)
the healthcare fortress could do with some better regulation, deregulation and competition
embrace technology (even in records and accounting)
and look at their lobbying muscle, it is ridiculous


and happy holidays  






Happy holidays! 
Health care is not a choice or free to any society
The US healthcare system has obvious issues, distorted by a grossly complex and opaque administration and systems. It is more costly and has less favorable outcomes than many developed nations. 
A great example is with Rx and how manufacturers, insurers and PBMs basically have the sickest patients subsidize lower overall premiums. eg, the rebates manufacturers pay for drugs are mostly absorbed by the insurer and a small % the PBM. So when a sick patient with a high deductible, or worse those without insurance, has their script filled, they pay the gross price before all those manufacturer rebates, whcih again flow to the insurer/PBM. 

The key difference is other countries rely on single-payer, universal care, whiel the US has insurers and PBMs that extract profit...and judging by the lopsided number of lawsuits against these types of companies, also prevalent to fraud. 
Labor and continued investment in new facilities, resources, innovations are the major costs...but undoubtedly our system an added layer of cost.
I dont necessarily want gov healthcare, but at a minimum a non-profit type system  where profits are share with members/patients. And having everyone contributing to the coverage pool throughout their lives also reduces costs by adding diversification. 
islander

islander Avatar

Location: West coast somewhere
Gender: Male


Posted: Dec 9, 2025 - 8:43am

 miamizsun wrote:


proper labelling is essential in building a solution
i get that we all want affordable and free goods (and services)
but there is a cost for these services
in healthcare, i think the biggest expenses are hospitals, doctors and to a lesser degree staff, then admin and insurance overhead
pushing six trillion or so (fifteen to sixteen thousand busk per person)
that has to come down drastically before we just start throwing more money into that beast
asking or forcing a small group of people to take care of this will not work 
obviously cannibalizing successful people or producers would also cause your tax rev to fall through the floor (they would stop being productive)
the healthcare fortress could do with some better regulation, deregulation and competition
embrace technology (even in records and accounting)
and look at their lobbying muscle, it is ridiculous


and happy holidays  






EVERY other major economy (and about 1/2 of the remaining minor ones) have implemented some form of universal healthcare. Our system allows those companies to lobby to remain the outlier instead of spending a similar amount of money to treat people better. Ridiculous is a perfect descriptor.
islander

islander Avatar

Location: West coast somewhere
Gender: Male


Posted: Dec 9, 2025 - 8:38am

 black321 wrote:

Not sure i follow, but the vulnerable in this situation (healthcare) are the insurers and PBMs, and their stockholders. 



The vulnerable I was referring to are the ones that will suffer with poor or lost healthcare, not the ones that will suffer with 'only' 10% bonuses on their 6+ figure salaries. The dude Luigi shot was a kind of a victim, but hardly vulnerable.
miamizsun

miamizsun Avatar

Location: (3283.1 Miles SE of RP)
Gender: Male


Posted: Dec 9, 2025 - 6:41am

 black321 wrote:


I dont like to get behind labels, but...
I am for universal healthcare, tuition free education, worker and environmental protections, and higher taxes on the wealthy (defined as making over ~$1M a year, or assets over $100M).


proper labelling is essential in building a solution
i get that we all want affordable and free goods (and services)
but there is a cost for these services
in healthcare, i think the biggest expenses are hospitals, doctors and to a lesser degree staff, then admin and insurance overhead
pushing six trillion or so (fifteen to sixteen thousand busk per person)
that has to come down drastically before we just start throwing more money into that beast
asking or forcing a small group of people to take care of this will not work 
obviously cannibalizing successful people or producers would also cause your tax rev to fall through the floor (they would stop being productive)
the healthcare fortress could do with some better regulation, deregulation and competition
embrace technology (even in records and accounting)
and look at their lobbying muscle, it is ridiculous


and happy holidays  



black321

black321 Avatar

Location: An earth without maps
Gender: Male


Posted: Dec 8, 2025 - 9:46am

 islander wrote:


FYT - We have two captured parties that maintain a duopoly for appearance and control. They both serve the same set of constituents, and you and I are not in that set.  Until control is wrested from these people, nothing will change. I don't know how it can be done without significant harm to many vulnerable people. The question really is how much harm are the vulnerable suffering now and at what point is the alternative better. I think we are close to an answer. 

Not sure i follow, but the vulnerable in this situation (healthcare) are the insurers and PBMs, and their stockholders. 

islander

islander Avatar

Location: West coast somewhere
Gender: Male


Posted: Dec 8, 2025 - 8:55am

 ColdMiser wrote:

It's high time for some major changes in how we govern/operate. Healthcare, Education should be stripped down to the studs and completely reworked. The tax system requires similar treatment. Presently if feels as if the government exists to serve those who have the means to pay for influence and the majority of Americans are left to fight it out on social media. Current Democratic leadership is incapable of moving us out of this desert. 



This is what most other modern countries have done to some level. 
islander

islander Avatar

Location: West coast somewhere
Gender: Male


Posted: Dec 8, 2025 - 8:55am

 ColdMiser wrote:

It's high time for some major changes in how we govern/operate. Healthcare, Education should be stripped down to the studs and completely reworked. The tax system requires similar treatment. Presently if feels as if the government exists to serve those who have the means to pay for influence and the majority of Americans are left to fight it out on social media. Current Democratic leadership is incapable of moving us out of this desert. 



FYT - We have two captured parties that maintain a duopoly for appearance and control. They both serve the same set of constituents, and you and I are not in that set.  Until control is wrested from these people, nothing will change. I don't know how it can be done without significant harm to many vulnerable people. The question really is how much harm are the vulnerable suffering now and at what point is the alternative better. I think we are close to an answer. 
Red_Dragon

Red_Dragon Avatar

Location: Gilead


Posted: Dec 8, 2025 - 7:44am

 miamizsun wrote:


what is it about their proposed solutions that we should entertain again? just curious...

edit: early in life i had similar thoughts
so what changed for me?
i'm literally surrounded by thousands and thousands of people from all over the globe that have been in these types of situations
same proposals/verbiage/political sermons and ended up with very bad results
usually when asked, they think we are bonkers for going down that road...





Pretty much what Black321 thinks.
ColdMiser

ColdMiser Avatar

Location: On the Trail
Gender: Male


Posted: Dec 8, 2025 - 7:39am

 black321 wrote:


I dont like to get behind labels, but...
I am for universal healthcare, tuition free education, worker and environmental protections, and higher taxes on the wealthy (defined as making over ~$1M a year, or assets over $100M).

It's high time for some major changes in how we govern/operate. Healthcare, Education should be stripped down to the studs and completely reworked. The tax system requires similar treatment. Presently if feels as if the government exists to serve those who have the means to pay for influence and the majority of Americans are left to fight it out on social media. Current Democratic leadership is incapable of moving us out of this desert. 

black321

black321 Avatar

Location: An earth without maps
Gender: Male


Posted: Dec 8, 2025 - 7:32am

 miamizsun wrote:


what is it about their proposed solutions that we should entertain again? just curious...

edit: early in life i had similar thoughts
so what changed for me?
i'm literally surrounded by thousands and thousands of people from all over the globe that have been in these types of situations
same proposals/verbiage/political sermons and ended up with very bad results
usually when asked, they think we are bonkers for going down that road...





I dont like to get behind labels, but...
I am for universal healthcare, tuition free education, worker and environmental protections, and higher taxes on the wealthy (defined as making over ~$1M a year, or assets over $100M).
miamizsun

miamizsun Avatar

Location: (3283.1 Miles SE of RP)
Gender: Male


Posted: Dec 8, 2025 - 4:19am

 Red_Dragon wrote:


I would join a democratic socialist party.


what is it about their proposed solutions that we should entertain again? just curious...

edit: early in life i had similar thoughts
so what changed for me?
i'm literally surrounded by thousands and thousands of people from all over the globe that have been in these types of situations
same proposals/verbiage/political sermons and ended up with very bad results
usually when asked, they think we are bonkers for going down that road...



kcar

kcar Avatar



Posted: Dec 7, 2025 - 2:37pm

 ScottFromWyoming wrote:


Massachuettes eh, close enough.




R_P

R_P Avatar

Gender: Male


Posted: Dec 7, 2025 - 1:36pm

Patronizing ex-contender
Hillary doubles down: Young people don't know why they criticize Israel
The former Secretary of State told Doha audience that Americans just don't have 'context' for what they see plainly with their own eyes in Gaza.
R_P

R_P Avatar

Gender: Male


Posted: Dec 2, 2025 - 1:28pm


Red_Dragon

Red_Dragon Avatar

Location: Gilead


Posted: Nov 21, 2025 - 1:56pm

 ScottFromWyoming wrote:






'zakly
ScottFromWyoming

ScottFromWyoming Avatar

Location: Powell
Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 21, 2025 - 1:09pm

 Red_Dragon wrote:


I would join a democratic socialist party.




Red_Dragon

Red_Dragon Avatar

Location: Gilead


Posted: Nov 21, 2025 - 12:05pm

 ScottFromWyoming wrote:


Massachuettes eh, close enough.


I would join a democratic socialist party.
ScottFromWyoming

ScottFromWyoming Avatar

Location: Powell
Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 21, 2025 - 11:57am

 R_P wrote:

"Mamdani's Party"




Massachuettes eh, close enough.
R_P

R_P Avatar

Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 21, 2025 - 11:40am

"Mamdani's Party"

theadmfreebird

theadmfreebird Avatar

Location: PIACENZA (ITALIA)


Posted: Nov 14, 2025 - 3:28am

sorry for your situation .... 

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